Browning 1919 7.62x54r Problem

[Zoltta]

Well i just got my kit and tested it down at the range and few problems occurred. 1 the firing pin wasnt dropping when trigger pulled. I understand that is a tight headspace issue. I took the bolt apart and then reassembled just to make sure it wasnt anything in there and then it ran fine, but a few times it happened again.

Second, some of the shells were feeding very strangely. The shells were going in sideways, vertical and getting stuck horizontally. Headspace issue?

Third and MOST IMPORTANT problem i was more worried about. On the rounds that wouldnt drop the firing pin i took out and noticed the primer has been struck but not as deep as if the trigger would have dropped. They didnt go off. It seems the hammer isnt even being cocked and the firing pin is still forward striking the next round as it feeds it. Maybe its because the firing pin isnt locking with the sear. This never happened when it was 308

Then the part i was worried about happen. It ran away on me and one of them actually went off as it fed. It basically slam fired giving it a real fast 2 round burst as the second shell went in. Thank god there were only 2 rounds left on the belt seeing as i live in a communist state that gives you enough shit on your semi guns. I dont need unwanted trouble for an accident. I believe this is related to problem number 1

Also yes im using a 30-06 booster and im using Czech 147g steel case.

I need help on this because i have a shoot tomorrow and i would like to have the problem sorted out before hand. Thanks

I also posted this on 1919a4.com but mods need to approve the post first. Figured id try here too

EDIT: I also might have a theory here. The links are REALLY tight, it takes a few tries to pull them fuckers out. The sear and firing pin is no where near worn out. Since some rounds arent feeding into the Tslot, and the hammer isnt being cocked sometimes, my theory is the links are so tight that when the bolt is blown back its going back far enough to feed the next round by not far enough to cock the hammer. Once i pulled the rounds out of the links enough, it DIDNT have any problems except for ONE which may have been a little too tight. I cant pull them out too far or the links will get in the way of the front cart guide and not eject. NOTE i didnt WD-40 the links like i was told to due to the fact that i didnt have any....so im going to try it tommorow. What do you guys think?

[Kali Komrade]

Oh boy I wouldn't load up more than three rounds at a time till you get this worked out... The first thing I would check is to see how freely the sear travels in the sear slot... make sure there are no burrs etc. and that it can go up and down to catch the firing pin properly... Secondly do you happen to have a back up sear spring... Perhaps the sear spring is too weak and is not catching the firing pin upon cocking properly under fire... In addition to that make sure that the sear does not stick out beyond the back of the bolt as the buffer will pound the back of the sear and cause damage...

What kind of links are you using they should be the Izzy straight shoulder links if your trying to run the M1 30-06 links that won't fly...

[Urban_Ops]

Is oiling the links something that is done commonly?

[Zoltta]

Oh boy I wouldn't load up more than three rounds at a time till you get this worked out... The first thing I would check is to see how freely the sear travels in the sear slot... make sure there are no burrs etc. and that it can go up and down to catch the firing pin properly... Secondly do you happen to have a back up sear spring... Perhaps the sear spring is too weak and is not catching the firing pin upon cocking properly under fire... In addition to that make sure that the sear does not stick out beyond the back of the bolt as the buffer will pound the back of the sear and cause damage...

What kind of links are you using they should be the Izzy straight shoulder links if your trying to run the M1 30-06 links that won't fly...

Im using izzy links yes. The guy who built the kit said 30-06 links work but you dont seat them in too tight. The sear is fine, it doesnt get caught up on anything. Nothing is wrong with the sear im pretty sure since this only happened once i converted to this caliber, it ran like a pro in 308. It COULD be the sear spring since i had to take it in and out of the bolt a few times. It could have weakened it, who knows.

Urban: Sometimes it helps run things smoother. The maker of my kit told me to lube it up before use. This is something i didnt do, could be the problem.

[Kali Komrade]

I don't think it would be anything with the links the WD40 does help with the 54r stuff its SOP for the 1919_4_ME's conversion he has...

Make sure the sear spring isn't hanging up or anything... I also remember a while back and it isn't that common but the sear as you look at it from the back of the bolt is supposed to be clearance for the recoil spring... That can cause sear hicups too... I'd probibly hedge my bet through and replace that sear spring...

[1919_4_ME]

I always spray a little WD-40 on the belts as there loaded up in the gun. This will help extraction on the steel cases. Remember its steel pulling on steel (links) so they will need a little lube or they will definitley get stuck, this will compound onto other problems as well. 1919's need lots of oil!

[Zoltta]

I always spray a little WD-40 on the belts as there loaded up in the gun. This will help extraction on the steel cases. Remember its steel pulling on steel (links) so they will need a little lube or they will definitley get stuck, this will compound onto other problems as well. 1919's need lots of oil!

Yeah the initial pull for the first round to feed into the chamber is TOUGH as hell. My fingers are sore from pulling that shit back today

[Zoltta]

UPDATE:

Ok well i got down the the range and fixed my problem. Apparently the Sear Spring was weak like everyone said. Once i fixed that problem, firing pin was cocked and no more striking cases. Ran like a purring kitten after that.

Now my other problem is this and this is kind of my fault because i didnt check. When i bought my links from a vendor at a gun show, the sign said they were izzy links. They are NOT izzy links they are FN30 links. Im assuming this was a potential problem. The problem was no matter how i sat the cartridge in the link it was impossible to manually feed after i closed the top cover. My hands are almost bleeding from this. It seems that when i try and feed it, it kind of pulls on an angle cause the round to bind up with the rest. Its basically twisting. That an its just extremely tight. When i did get it to feed it ran very smooth except quite a few rounds would misfeed, some vertical, some not at all because the extractor didnt pull a round for some reason.

Also as far as lubing goes, i did not lube before linking them up, but after linking them. In that case it probably did nothing but make a mess since the inside of the link was still dry. Ill make sure i dont next time.

So its either one of 2 things, not lubing the wrong way or straight up wrong links.

[Kali Komrade]

I think the consensus will agree the FN30 links are a 30-06 link so if its supposed to work with M1 30-06 links it should work with those...

Now my suggestion would be to order some Izzy links when you link up rounds you'll notice that the belt is a bit more flexible which will compensate more for the rimmed round... Another thing I noticed even when I didn't seat my .308 rounds all the way into the M1 links the belt would always have a curve to it and could sometimes get cocked the wrong way and cause a possible failure to feed...
I know 1919_4_ME's runs like a bat out of hell with the Izzy links... That thing would eat a 225 round belt in nothin' flat...

Glad it was just the sear spring...:thumb:

[Zoltta]

I think the consensus will agree the FN30 links are a 30-06 link so if its supposed to work with M1 30-06 links it should work with those...

Now my suggestion would be to order some Izzy links when you link up rounds you'll notice that the belt is a bit more flexible which will compensate more for the rimmed round... Another thing I noticed even when I didn't seat my .308 rounds all the way into the M1 links the belt would always have a curve to it and could sometimes get cocked the wrong way and cause a possible failure to feed...
I know 1919_4_ME's runs like a bat out of hell with the Izzy links... That thing would eat a 225 round belt in nothin' flat...

Glad it was just the sear spring...:thumb:

yeah the sear spring got me thinking. After i installed the kit i remember the trigger being lighter and then remember using a bad method of prying out the spring. At the time i didnt realize you could just slide it over and pull it out. That indeed weakened it when i tried to put it back in the same way. All i did was bend it to match my buddies sear spring identically and it works like a charm.

One thing i noticed about the FN30 links is that they are a little wider than the 06 USGI links which is why i didnt think they were 30-06 and the FN30s are also bottle neck. The izzies are straight correct? I may have found a guy whos willing to trade some depends on how many i can dig up. Hopefull it goes through

[1919_4_ME]

.308 Izzy links are the way to go they will run flawless with them. Theres a place online think its Coles Dist that has them for $100/2000 Izzy links. Cant beat that price and there brand spankin new not all distorted or bent links. Been running the 54r Czech Silver tip for ever with no problems at all.

[Kali Komrade]

Yep and you are correct they are the straight necked... If I get a chance today I'll post a picture... Should be a mellow day for me today... I hope...:big:

[Kali Komrade]

Hey Zoltta heres some pictures from my .30 cal. Link collection...

From Left to Right...
(r.) .30cal M1 link (m.) .30cal Izzy link (r.) M60 .30cal link

http://www.beltfedshooters.com/photopost/data/500/medium/IMG_1130.JPG

Below same order as above left to right but this is the back of the links.

http://www.beltfedshooters.com/photopost/data/500/medium/IMG_1134.JPG

Now here is a close up showing the bottle neck of the M1 .30cal link (left) vs. the Straight neck of the Izzy link (right)

http://www.beltfedshooters.com/photopost/data/500/medium/IMG_1137.JPG

The above picture is about as close as you'll find on the net showing you the difference between the links necks... I was confused between the two in the beginning so I just bought what ever I could find... The M60 .30cal link was also used on the Canadian C5A1 which is there modified version of the M1919A4 and is also the link used in the M240 currently... Hope this helps for your link I.D.

[Zoltta]

Hey Zoltta heres some pictures from my .30 cal. Link collection...

From Left to Right...
(r.) .30cal M1 link (m.) .30cal Izzy link (r.) M60 .30cal link

http://www.beltfedshooters.com/photopost/data/500/medium/IMG_1130.JPG

Below same order as above left to right but this is the back of the links.

http://www.beltfedshooters.com/photopost/data/500/medium/IMG_1134.JPG

Now here is a close up showing the bottle neck of the M1 .30cal link (left) vs. the Straight neck of the Izzy link (right)

http://www.beltfedshooters.com/photopost/data/500/medium/IMG_1137.JPG

The above picture is about as close as you'll find on the net showing you the difference between the links necks... I was confused between the two in the beginning so I just bought what ever I could find... The M60 .30cal link was also used on the Canadian C5A1 which is there modified version of the M1919A4 and is also the link used in the M240 currently... Hope this helps for your link I.D.

awesome thanks. I just ordered some izzy links a few minutes ago from Ironcreations. He sells them 100 in a pack so i ordered 300 for now.

[GUNNER 50]

Hay , I think I just bought a top cover from you on 1919a4.com....I have a bunch of Izzy links I would be willing to trade instead of money for the top cover....How many links would you want for the $25 bucks I owe you?

[Zoltta]

Hay , I think I just bought a top cover from you on 1919a4.com....I have a bunch of Izzy links I would be willing to trade instead of money for the top cover....How many links would you want for the $25 bucks I owe you?

I kinda rather have the money since the money i used to by the links was a loaner from a friend so i can shoot my 1919 on the 4th. I dont get paid for another 2 weeks so im broker than shit. Otherwise yeah id take the links but i already ordered some :thinkin:

[Zoltta]

Problem fixed for charging issues

Barrel extension needed to be filed a little and now it charges without me even trying